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Post by Astroruss on Jun 18, 2013 17:49:25 GMT -5
Perhaps I've misunderstood...Could you explain to me where the grey is in statements such as "Drugs are pure evil and should be banished from the face of the Earth." and "Only idiots do drugs."? It's too easy to get addicted and abuse drugs, especially if they become legal and are available everywhere. Marijuana isn't so harmful in the short run, true, but it's long term effects detract from your body's ability to process oxygen and endorphins, harm your eyesight, and screw up your ability to focus and concentrate.
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Post by Astroruss on Jun 18, 2013 17:57:51 GMT -5
Simply can't agree with you there. Not a single word of that post is just black and white. Full of grey. It's the interpretation, not 'each to their own'. I agree; I've seen too many people screw up there lives over drug addiction just like with alcohol. Cocaine and meth, especially. Meth addiction is very common in the U.S. South. Now, marijuana may not be as bad as those two, but I've seen no evidence of it being beneficial either, despite what doctors and the media say. The potheads I know have ruined their lives over its abuse, just like tobacco smokers do. The potheads I knew couldn't breathe hardly without hacking their guts up, couldn't see strait enough to walk, had no idea who I was or where they were at parties, and sometimes even passed out while standing up. They spent their money on joints and pot brownie baking ingredients instead of their rent and couldn't hold regular jobs because they couldn't remain focused enough to drive. And two of my close friends dropped out of college because they were too stoned to think strait and keep up with their classwork. No, I think the marijuana legalization is just another trendy cause to fight for right now, and I'm against it. I say keep it illegal.
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Post by marle on Jun 22, 2013 13:01:09 GMT -5
Yeah, that choice is rather subjective so not great for a poll. I would think of it as regulations that are stronger than either tobacco or alcohol regulations. Such as, you can grow a limited amount for personal use but only the government can sell it, there would be no advertisements, and no one under 21 can use it. The age limit in the US is unfortunate. It's higher than almost everywhere else on Earth, and past a certain point, age just isn't the greatest indicator of the real abusers. That said, I'd probably go for keeping it in line with other legal drugs for consistency. I think 21 is a good cut-off age - the reason being that studies have shown marijuana disrupts the development of the brain in young people, and the brain continues to develop into ones early 20s. Since in the US we have the 21 cut-off age for alcohol, it makes sense for us to go with that.
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Post by marle on Jun 22, 2013 13:05:14 GMT -5
Many of us who support decriminalization or legalization of marijuana do so because we believe it is for the greater good. It is not just a libertarian issue, or fairness with regards to how the law treats alcohol and cigarettes. The war on marijuana and users is highly impractical and you can't ignore the harm caused by imprisoning the large numbers of people involved in it, and importantly, the proliferation of gangs and street violence that these laws encourage.
We had Prohibition in the US, which is almost universally acknowledged to have been a failure. We are not uncaring people for not supporting that kind of policy - this is the world we see around us, and the history we know.
I'm sure legalization will produce some kind of increase in marijuana use, but the amount is exaggerated. Harm will be done by legalizing it, but more harm is done by keeping it illegal. It really comes down to that. I believe it is a less harmful choice, and one that is on the side of personal freedom and fairness, so that's a better deal to me.
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Post by Sexy Spork #37 on Jun 22, 2013 14:43:34 GMT -5
Would you subscribe to the idea that the gangs and street violence would continue in regard to another substance? You legalize drugs they'll simply move onto something else. That's an issue of money, surely. I think drawing a battle line is the only way to stop them. Legalization isn't the issue, in my opinion. We'll always have war. Drugs or no drugs.
There must be other options to dealing with drug users and sellers than imprisonment. A hefty fine. They'll be broke and might consider sorting their lives out. It won't lead them into a life of crime because they're already criminals. Surely the 'impractical' argument is taking the easy route? It's more logical to take the more complex route because the easy route leads to a nation full of drug addicts which is obviously not great.
Drug legalization will affect the greater good. So many people will die, affecting those they're connected with. So much crime will happen, affecting others. So many people will use because of the temptation when otherwise they would've been in college. Society will simply not cope. No amount of regulation could prevent that. Doing the greater good is using ones brain and nothing about legalization, to me, seems logical.
There's no denying the extremely strict laws on alcohol and cigarettes prevent widespread harm to our society. Without these laws, society would suffer greatly. It's logical to apply a similar argument to drugs. Laws regarding alcohol and cigarettes are there to soften the impact of them. Hypothetical question - would society be better if they were illegal? I don't think it's right to point to Prohibition because it was a different time. It would work nowadays.
It's not an issue of freedom. We deny people the right to smoke where they want so why shouldn't we deny people the right to use another highly, dangerous, equally as harmful drug? Freedoms and fairness have to be restricted to maintain a working society. It's the job of government.
Ask yourself what would happen if it became legal? Protests? I'd be with those peaceful protests. But it's inevitable they'll turn ugly and turn into riots. Drug shops selling all these drugs to the hippies will be set on fire. I could see that breaking out in places. I don't condone that, but I think it's inevitable. That damage won't do any good for the legalization argument.
It's such a sore topic.
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Post by Farouche on Jun 22, 2013 16:13:39 GMT -5
Ask yourself what would happen if it became legal? Protests? Riots? Drug shops selling copious amounts of drugs to a queue of hippies a mile long being set on fire? Certainly. And I'd be with them. And the damage that'll do won't make legalization worth it. "Legalizing drugs is dangerous because if you do, I will riot in the streets and set fire to hippies."
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Post by Sexy Spork #37 on Jun 22, 2013 16:42:15 GMT -5
Misquote. Don't believe I said that.
Part of the protests.
I'll correct it for anyone who misunderstood.
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Post by skyhint on Jul 2, 2013 5:49:53 GMT -5
I think a fine for posession of marijuanna is a good idea and it doesn't need to cost a lot of money to enforce. Just hand out tickets like they do for traffic violations. I believe it is very important for the law to let people know that they are on the wrong path. We all make bad decisions now and then but if we can't even send a clear signal as to what the right choice is then we are helping people hurt themselves.
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Post by Astroruss on Jul 2, 2013 15:44:01 GMT -5
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Post by marle on Jul 4, 2013 17:04:25 GMT -5
I think decriminalizing it and instead making it a fine-able offense addresses most of the problems. I would be very happy to see government take that step. Personally, I prefer to see it legalized. I don't think government needs to impose morality, per se, on people. This is my personal philosophy and I respect other opinions on that. As far as harm, I do think marijuana causes harm just like alcohol does, but only when its abused. I admit I am not the expert on the nature of marijuana because I've never tried it. I am not an absolutist on this (for instance cocaine should be illegal), but I think you need very compelling reasons to make a natural plant illegal. To address some specific things: Drug legalization will affect the greater good. So many people will die, affecting those they're connected with. So much crime will happen, affecting others. I don't believe "so much" crime will happen if marijuana is legalized. As far as I know, marijuana isn't associated with much crime except possibly some DUIs and then all of the crime that it's associated with simply as a result of being illegal. There's no denying the extremely strict laws on alcohol and cigarettes prevent widespread harm to our society. Without these laws, society would suffer greatly. It's logical to apply a similar argument to drugs. Laws regarding alcohol and cigarettes are there to soften the impact of them. Hypothetical question - would society be better if they were illegal? I don't think it's right to point to Prohibition because it was a different time. It would work nowadays. You're talking about regulations on legal substances, which I am greatly in favor of. If marijuana were legalized, I think there should definitely be strong regulations on it, particularly on its sale. I believe there's a big difference between tightly regulating something and making it outright illegal. Criminals no longer sell alcohol, and therefore, are no longer empowered and emboldened by it being illegal. I also don't see how Prohibition would work nowadays, as if the United States in particular needs more prisons to house all of the people involved in the consumption and sale of alcohol. Ask yourself what would happen if it became legal? Protests? I'd be with those peaceful protests. But it's inevitable they'll turn ugly and turn into riots. Drug shops selling all these drugs to the hippies will be set on fire. I could see that breaking out in places. I don't condone that, but I think it's inevitable. That damage won't do any good for the legalization argument. I don't propose that it should happen without public support. If there is enough outrage, sure, people should think twice about making it legal and perhaps go the route of decriminalization with a fine. But more of the population are becoming liberal on this issue and I think some form of tightly-controlled legalization is not far off.
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Post by marle on Aug 29, 2013 19:43:56 GMT -5
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Post by CharlotteGirl on Aug 30, 2013 20:53:50 GMT -5
Yes legalise it and seriously why not heroin, cocaine, all hard drugs as well. Prohibition is a largely pointless waste of law enforcement resources, while the illegal drugs trade creates so much crime and violence in many countries such as Mexico. It also means that there's no quality control whatsoever.
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