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Post by fightingspirit on Jul 11, 2009 10:29:21 GMT -5
You don't seem to like quoting this part, FS. But I do! Here it is again, in case anybody missed it: Fightingspirit --------------
American women are looking for some unwarranted glamor, fame, and social prowess, that's supposed to be cast upon them regardless of what they actually represent with themselves. It's not surprising to see US women disparaging those from East Europe since they they are perceiving them as a threat to the status quo. You see, women don't like to see men having options. Men are much more obliging as helpless slaves.
Farouche -------------
Mikelan and FightingSpirit are either embittered basement-dwellers with no prospects, or trolls.
Fightingspirit ---------------
Ok, but what exactly is so wrong about having preference for women of a different ethnicity. Ok, first of all, I stand by that statement and I reiterated that basic thought in one of my last posts. I do think that American women have overinflated egos and I think that it's more than just an isolated problem; it's widespread. Second of all, You might want to answer some of my arguments if You want to continue the conversation before accusing me of back-pedaling or side-stepping the issue. |
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Post by fightingspirit on Jul 11, 2009 10:42:46 GMT -5
I would say that the aggressive rebuttal and troll name-calling hinted at it ever so slightly. Do you really think the aggression was due to you "having preference for women of a different ethnicity?" Partially, yes. The other aspect was that I used broad strokes to paint a picture and some no doubt thought that I did it unfairly. Well, too bad, because I repeat, that has been my experience and of the majority of those whom I know personally. I can't change that fact. No, one was your life experience; the other was an offensive generalization that has earned you a ton of disrespect. Do you see it yet? I don't care about respect or lack thereof. I can only call the world from my point of view. I can't help if others disagree, but I am not going to water down my views because some Joe or Jane out there may not like it. Well then I think you should leave. Thank you for the advice, but I think that I am going to stay for the time being. At least as long as I find this forum useful. Do you expect me to lie in order to be politically correct? No, just be sociable.  That has got to be one of the worst things that you can say to a person. Be sociable. Forget being insightful, truthful, a man of integrity - you're supposed to just fit in with the herd. Thank you again, but I prefer to maintain my individuality and at least a shred of dignity. |
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Post by Scotty on Jul 11, 2009 13:47:20 GMT -5
I like American Women. ;D
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Post by arizona on Jul 11, 2009 18:03:36 GMT -5
Every now and then, I become disillusioned with the nastiness on this board. There are people here who seem to treat others the same way they complain about being treated. Not cool.
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Post by strawberrysweetie on Jul 11, 2009 23:01:57 GMT -5
Aww, and we know how you feel about aggressiveness in females. But that's American women for ya: we just don't let you get away with anything, do we? Better go to another forum if you want the mean, aggressive American lady to leave you alone while you whine whine whine all the way home. I don't have a problem with aggressiveness. In fact, I have a fairly dominant personality so I need someone who can challenge me. I welcome that. My problem is with the unfairness that has become abundant in society where women assume superior poses completely unwarranted by their social standing and achievements; purely on account of their gender and/or physical beauty. Hence my assertion that I prefer foreign women, such as those from Eastern Europe, because they have not yet become contaminated with these irrational ideas. I like to be able to talk to a woman without assuming superficial poserisms. I like to interact like I would with my best friend, who just happens to be super, super attractive. You keep saying you don't like superficial things....but then you highly emphasize how you have such attractive friends. Super contradictory, if you ask me.  . . . I didn't say most women dislike me. In fact, most of them are initially attracted, but they lose interest when they see that I am trying to drag them into an actual conversation. . . Well, if it turns out to be a 'conversation' such as the one here now, then it's no wonder. . . . Unfortunately, most young women these days prefer to spend their evenings within the confines of a loud pub or an extremely loud night club where conversation is impossible. Yes, you can get a one night stand out of those places, but trying to build a meaningful relationship is like banging your head against a stone pillar. Then stop limiting yourself to such places and look elsewhere. There are decent American women out there, you just don't want to see it, for whatever reason. You don't seem to like quoting this part, FS. But I do! Here it is again, in case anybody missed it: Fightingspirit --------------
American women are looking for some unwarranted glamor, fame, and social prowess, that's supposed to be cast upon them regardless of what they actually represent with themselves. It's not surprising to see US women disparaging those from East Europe since they they are perceiving them as a threat to the status quo. You see, women don't like to see men having options. Men are much more obliging as helpless slaves.
Farouche -------------
Mikelan and FightingSpirit are either embittered basement-dwellers with no prospects, or trolls.
Fightingspirit ---------------
Ok, but what exactly is so wrong about having preference for women of a different ethnicity. Ok, first of all, I stand by that statement and I reiterated that basic thought in one of my last posts. I do think that American women have overinflated egos and I think that it's more than just an isolated problem; it's widespread. This is what is so bothersome. It's one thing to say something like, " Many American women that I know have overinflated egos" and another thing completely when you leave out the "many" (or whatever adj.) and simply make a blanket statement that ALL American women are such a way, which is what you did several times. I don't care about respect or lack thereof. I can only call the world from my point of view. I can't help if others disagree, but I am not going to water down my views because some Joe or Jane out there may not like it. I can't believe your first statement. It's clear to me you certainly expect to receive respect at least, but you just don't care about giving it. Also, this isn't just a matter of disagreeing, though....it's the fact that you're making such blanket statements about American women. Such statements are just so obviously wrong, because there are always exceptions. It baffles me as to how you can stand by what you said. And yet, the really funny thing is that you feel so wounded when someone (a female) even refers to any blanket statement about males. Double standard. Anyway...whatever, I'm done with this. This is all absurd and I don't even know why I'm responding again. If I were to give you any kind of advice, though...it would be to MOVE out of the U.S. |
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Post by madiocre on Jul 13, 2009 6:19:26 GMT -5
This all really confuses me.
ok I'm presuming by american women you mean western women in general. And I'm presuming that australian and american cultures are quite similar. I know a little about ukranian/ russian cultures and really I can't believe you when you say that you prefer them because they are less superficial. My Dad lives there he see what they do. We are talking about a culture that when they are starving they will go out and buy their last little pittance of money on fine clothery .nWalk the streets and you'll notice women dressed very formally in expensive clothes yet everyone is starving.
As for most of eastern europe having high academic standards I would like to know where you got that information. My father works as an english teacher in the ukraine and used to work in Rusia. The stories he relays are quite contrary in that for those two contries the university sustem (amongst others) are corrupt only rich people get good grade because lecturers tend to only give them to the people who bribe them.
But more importantly flight spirit I dont understand what you are trying to say ( possibly it's my less superior western woman brain at fault here ) You keep sayng that we are more superficial and lose interest when you try to have a conversation that is of meaning. You also say that you feel you have to act like a pser I dont know what you mean. What is so different in topics that you speak to thoses women about and the topics you have to "endure" with american women. Perhaps its a case of seriousness ? Is it that we like to be entertained it a big part for us because quite frankly we actually dont need men to depend on where as for some other cultures they do there for in talking they may be more serious and romantic? I dont know i'm just crazily theorising .
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Post by Farouche on Jul 13, 2009 7:14:24 GMT -5
Fightingspirit --------------
American women are looking for some unwarranted glamor, fame, and social prowess, that's supposed to be cast upon them regardless of what they actually represent with themselves. It's not surprising to see US women disparaging those from East Europe since they they are perceiving them as a threat to the status quo. You see, women don't like to see men having options. Men are much more obliging as helpless slaves.
Farouche ------------------
Mikelan and FightingSpirit are either embittered basement-dwellers with no prospects, or trolls.
Fightingspirit -------------------
Ok, but what exactly is so wrong about having preference for women of a different ethnicity.
Fightingspirit --------------------
Ok, first of all, I stand by that statement and I reiterated that basic thought in one of my last posts. I do think that American women have overinflated egos and I think that it's more than just an isolated problem; it's widespread.
I can only say that you are perfect example of what I am talking about regardless if you're an American or not. Why is it that it's the most obnoxious, unwarrantedly self-adoring of men who always seem to be such experts on the flaws of femalekind? I think guys like FS are just terribly afraid of competition in the self-love department. But I don't think FS here has got anything to worry about, as we've seen:
I didn't say most women dislike me. In fact, most of them are initially attracted, but they lose interest when they see that I am trying to drag them into an actual conversation.
I have a fairly dominant personality so I need someone who can challenge me. I welcome that. My problem is with the unfairness that has become abundant in society where women assume superior poses completely unwarranted by their social standing and achievements; purely on account of their gender and/or physical beauty. Hence my assertion that I prefer foreign women, such as those from Eastern Europe, because they have not yet become contaminated with these irrational ideas. I like to be able to talk to a woman without assuming superficial poserisms. I like to interact like I would with my best friend, who just happens to be super, super attractive.
That has got to be one of the worst things that you can say to a person. Be sociable. Forget being insightful, truthful, a man of integrity - you're supposed to just fit in with the herd. Thank you again, but I prefer to maintain my individuality and at least a shred of dignity.
The other aspect was that I used broad strokes to paint a picture and some no doubt thought that I did it unfairly. Well, too bad, because I repeat, that has been my experience and of the majority of those whom I know personally. I can't change that fact.
Here we have an arrogant prick with delusions of insight, gnashing his teeth and accusing women of having over-inflated egos and tiny intellects. Exempting, of course, those women who fall prey to his charms, which of course no sane, intelligent woman would be able to resist... Yeah, I think I may have detected a few design flaws in the rigorous scientific process by which FS arrived at his ironclad laws of Truth about western women: conflict of interest, for one (bit suspicious how the "women who don't want to get it on with FS" and the "women who are inferior forms of life" groups coincide). And at least one glaring error of logic. |
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Post by Stranger on Jul 13, 2009 8:07:49 GMT -5
Do you really think the aggression was due to you "having preference for women of a different ethnicity?" Partially, yes. The other aspect was that I used broad strokes to paint a picture and some no doubt thought that I did it unfairly. Well, too bad, because I repeat, that has been my experience and of the majority of those whom I know personally. I can't change that fact. Then why ask "what exactly is so wrong about having preference for women of a different ethnicity?" when clearly you said something far more likely to anger people? You're coming across as a troll. I don't care about respect or lack thereof. I can only call the world from my point of view. I can't help if others disagree, but I am not going to water down my views because some Joe or Jane out there may not like it. I didn't ask you to. Thank you for the advice, but I think that I am going to stay for the time being. At least as long as I find this forum useful. It isn't "advice." It's what I think would maximize the happiness in this community. No, just be sociable. That has got to be one of the worst things that you can say to a person. Be sociable. Forget being insightful, truthful, a man of integrity - you're supposed to just fit in with the herd. Thank you again, but I prefer to maintain my individuality and at least a shred of dignity. Funny, I think what you said was one of the worst things you could say to anyone. You can disagree with people and still be sociable. You can hold unpopular views and still be sociable. You can relate personal experiences that fly in the face of what everyone else has experienced and still be perfectly sociable. You were blatantly and unapologetically offensive to many others on this board. That is not sociable. For someone self-described as "quite efficient in handling social situations," I would think this should be pretty obvious. Yeah, I think I may have detected a few design flaws in the rigorous scientific process by which FS arrived at his ironclad laws of Truth about western women: conflict of interest, for one (bit suspicious how the "women who don't want to get it on with FS" and the "women who are inferior forms of life" groups coincide). And at least one glaring error of logic. Really good point. And apologies to everyone else. I should've known this would drag on forever. Consider this post my last in the thread.  |
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Post by fightingspirit on Jul 13, 2009 8:13:18 GMT -5
This all really confuses me. ok I'm presuming by american women you mean western women in general. And I'm presuming that australian and american cultures are quite similar. I know a little about ukranian/ russian cultures and really I can't believe you when you say that you prefer them because they are less superficial. My Dad lives there he see what they do. We are talking about a culture that when they are starving they will go out and buy their last little pittance of money on fine clothery .nWalk the streets and you'll notice women dressed very formally in expensive clothes yet everyone is starving. As for most of eastern europe having high academic standards I would like to know where you got that information. My father works as an english teacher in the ukraine and used to work in Rusia. The stories he relays are quite contrary in that for those two contries the university sustem (amongst others) are corrupt only rich people get good grade because lecturers tend to only give them to the people who bribe them. But more importantly flight spirit I dont understand what you are trying to say ( possibly it's my less superior western woman brain at fault here ) You keep sayng that we are more superficial and lose interest when you try to have a conversation that is of meaning. You also say that you feel you have to act like a pser I dont know what you mean. What is so different in topics that you speak to thoses women about and the topics you have to "endure" with american women. Perhaps its a case of seriousness ? Is it that we like to be entertained it a big part for us because quite frankly we actually dont need men to depend on where as for some other cultures they do there for in talking they may be more serious and romantic? I dont know i'm just crazily theorising . Jess, To clarify - I have a few friends from Ukraine, a couple of guys and I can count about 4 women. You hit the nail on the head stating that they love to dress nice and they put emphasis on it. I noticed that as well. I don't have a problem with it because they are being very open and upfront about it when challenged. They are also able to manage extremely well with what little they have. I can only praise them for a down to earth approach to life despite the difficulties they face. In regards to education, I was thinking more about Czech republic, Slovakia, and particularly Poland, where they have top tier universities, which I know intimately because many of my family members attended them, and they leave in the dust the majority of American institutions. I've been on quite a few dates recently with American women, or those who have lived here for a number of years. Am I too serious? I can't be the ultimate judge of that because it would obviously be biased. The only thing that I can derive is what I've already stated. The initial interaction with foreign women is a lot easier because it is not pretentious. I can only apologize to those American women who feel offended, but that has been my life experience. Why would I be making it up? I also understand, or at least have come to understand that women love to be entertained and excited. You see, this is part of the problem. Women say that they want honest, laid back, hard working men, but what they fail to communicate is that they want men to have such qualities on top of being premier entertainers. You can't expect men to understand that point telepathically. Some of them will eventually get it of course, but all it does is lead to a whole lot of misunderstanding and frustration. All in all, I think that we can learn from each other greatly, but only if we overcome the obstacles and hang-ups of early, awkward interaction. Have a great day!! |
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Post by arizona on Jul 19, 2009 17:53:58 GMT -5
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Post by superlative introversion on Aug 14, 2009 2:30:54 GMT -5
I've been reading this thread and would like to come to fightingspirit's defense. I don't think he meant that all American women are like that but that a good portion of them are. Of course you can't stereotype an entire gender, and I think that the women who post on this board are definitely NOT the type he is talking about, by the mere fact that they post on this board. But there are indeed a large number of women out there who are only interested in loudmouth, uninteresting, and intellectually defunct men, whether you acknowledge that fact or not. To be an equal opportunity offender, I think the exact same is true of the other gender . I hope both genders on this particular thread are able to peacefully coexist. |
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Post by Farouche on Aug 14, 2009 11:34:42 GMT -5
SupInt---------------------------
I've been reading this thread and would like to come to fightingspirit's defense. I don't think he meant that all American women are like that but that a good portion of them are. Of course you can't stereotype an entire gender, and I think that the women who post on this board are definitely NOT the type he is talking about, by the mere fact that they post on this board. But there are indeed a large number of women out there who are only interested in loudmouth, uninteresting, and intellectually defunct men, whether you acknowledge that fact or not. To be an equal opportunity offender, I think the exact same is true of the other gender . I hope both genders on this particular thread are able to peacefully coexist. Did you really read the entire thread, or are you just faithfully jumping to the defense of the brotherhood? Because FS blatantly accused board member me, at least, of being "exactly" the kind of woman he was talking about, without knowing anything about me except that I think he's full of it. Whether you want to acknowledge this or not not, women on shy sites get dumped on way too often by the few (but loud) bitter angry-guys who see an easy target and pounce, knowing that at least some guys are likely to come to their defense, and that the women risk looking like "bitches" if they object. So, a little background there. It's not a problem, of course, if anybody just wants to lament that not many members of the opposite sex appreciate who they are as a quiet, thoughtful person. But the following is not cool, and is really not defensible as anything but an embarrassingly bitter rant: American women are looking for some unwarranted glamor, fame, and social prowess, that's supposed to be cast upon them regardless of what they actually represent with themselves. It's not surprising to see US women disparaging those from East Europe since they they are perceiving them as a threat to the status quo. You see, women don't like to see men having options. Men are much more obliging as helpless slaves. Yet FS has stated many times over that he 100% stands by exactly what this^ paragraph says. The most he would acknowledge throughout the thread is that the harshness of his words might shock and offend those not enlightened enough to see their mighty Truth. I appreciate that you're trying to be diplomatic, but I caution you against dialing down the sweeping nature of FS's unabashed generalization. It's not a "men versus women" issue, anyway; it's a "guys who bash women" versus "women who are sick of guys who bash women and think it's ok" thing, so no worries about a gender war, lol.  You personally seem like a reasonable guy: so if there are pretty much equal numbers of men and women who are idiots and attracted to idiots, then it makes no sense to single out "American women" as these arrogant airheads, unless the poster in question is, himself, an internet loudmouth looking to stir the pot, eh? I note that he never even tried to mitigate the sneering nature of his claims by suggesting, as you have, that American men or people in general might suffer the same deficiencies to the same extent that he claimed for the American women. In fact, he seemed to heartily approve of the notion that the perfected American male was well matched to the superior non-American females who appreciate a "decent, hard-working" guy and don't get all uppity and stuff. For the record, sure it's true that plenty of men and women have an inflated sense of self or aren't particularly intellectual. The dating pools are sufficiently big, however, that most people will be able to find an attractive peer with enough exposure, whether they're a noisy beer-swillin' frat boy with a beer-swillin' gal, a geek with another geek, or just two nearby points on the IQ bell curve finding each other and gettin' it on. Finding the right partner is rarely easy, and ranting about it is understandable and totally fine, 'slong as you're not being needlessly insulting and you don't really believe and insist that "women/men are shit" or whatever. On the other hand, asserting that the rant is a direct channeling of The Ultimate Truth and that the "poor, innocent women out there" are just pissed off that Political Correctness won't save them, this time, from being outed as the narcissistic harridans they are: not fine. If that seems like a small distinction to you, consider that it can be a big distinction for the targets. [And I hope to god reviving this thread doesn't bring Prince Charming winging back to these boards. ;D Although... I've got a post saved for the other thread that I thought it was too late to put up by the time I got around to doing it... so I guess that's ok. ;D] |
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Post by Naptaq on Aug 14, 2009 14:06:51 GMT -5
Actually it is I who has the most inflated sense of self on this forum! Kneel before Zod! 1 lol  |
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Post by Farouche on Aug 14, 2009 15:52:40 GMT -5
Ehhhh, ya gotta have an inflated sense of self sometimes. It lubricates the living. ;D
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Post by superlative introversion on Aug 17, 2009 2:01:46 GMT -5
Guilty, I only skimmed it for the best parts and couldn't resist coming to the defense of a fellow male . Ok, I admit his rather bitter accusation may have been unwarranted, but I can understand where it came from. I'm not trying to excuse it, but after years of rejection from the opposite sex, bitterness can be a very natural reaction. Believe me, I've been there. Shy men in particular have a difficult time in the dating world because they are expected to initiate, something women generally aren't expected to do. So in conclusion, I agree that he was wrong to make such sweeping generalizations towards American women. However, I understand how easy it is to fall into that mentality and I wouldn't be so quick to judge him. Have a nice day  . |
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