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Post by deadendphilosopher on Oct 18, 2008 23:14:44 GMT -5
I know he is genuinely very spiritual. Maybe he does just want to "get into my pants" but I don't think he thinks that's all he wants. I think he has a lot of integrity and wouldn't consciously try to use me. He was telling me that he broke up with his ex-girlfriend because the relationship got too lustful and unbalanced, and said he wishes he had waited a lot longer and gotten to know her better before having sex with her. He said he learned from that and is happy to just get to know me as a person before thinking about intimacy. I know that sounds far fetched, but unless my entire judgment of his character is completely off, I don't think he would lie to my face like that. Maybe I'm naive, but why is it assumed that the ultimate motive of males is always to get in a girl's pants, and that they will try to do this at all costs, without any regard for honesty? because most guys like having sex...alot. it's very important to them. most guys would be absolutely uninterested in a sexless relationship. at least, that's been my experience...and that of lots of other people. not that i blame them. i'm really not either. and yeah, they often will say just about anything to get into your pants, even if they do not 'consciously' plot and plan. But you're suggesting that the whole basis of our friendship is a lie, and if that's the case it seems pretty conscious on his part. It is hard for me to believe he could be so dishonest and despicable. He seems like a genuinely good person. |
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Post by deadendphilosopher on Oct 18, 2008 23:48:21 GMT -5
I know he is genuinely very spiritual. Maybe he does just want to "get into my pants" but I don't think he thinks that's all he wants. I think he has a lot of integrity and wouldn't consciously try to use me. He was telling me that he broke up with his ex-girlfriend because the relationship got too lustful and unbalanced, and said he wishes he had waited a lot longer and gotten to know her better before having sex with her. He said he learned from that and is happy to just get to know me as a person before thinking about intimacy. I know that sounds far fetched, but unless my entire judgment of his character is completely off, I don't think he would lie to my face like that. Maybe I'm naive, but why is it assumed that the ultimate motive of males is always to get in a girl's pants, and that they will try to do this at all costs, without any regard for honesty? Yes it is absolutely the motive at all costs without any regards for honesty. He is really working the spiritual angle because he thinks that will work best to get with you. I could pick out all the lines in your longer post of things he said an did and highlight and put playa line by them. There were a lot. Him deleting your number and making you call him if you want to see him is a playa game. It feeds his ego. In his mind any effort you make to see him or talk to him means he still has a chance of getting in your pants. You see him as a platonic friend only and he is wanting to rip your clothes off and get busy. This will never work. He is not even paying attention to the friendship part as everything he is doing and saying is to get in your pants and convince you to like him sexually. You really want to find out how much he is a friend tell him you met up with someone from early school days and are now engaged to him. Do you think all guys will do anything they can to sleep with a girl regardless of her feelings and regardless of honesty, or just "players"? You say he is really working the spiritual angel because he thinks it will work best, but I think I can say beyond a shadow of a doubt that he truly is extremely spiritual. I have searched him on the internet, and have found a couple of detailed biographical articles written about him because of the musical and humanitarian work he does, and they both center around a spiritual transformation he went through. He is a devoted follower of Amma Chi, and is even mentioned on her website for helping start one of her humanitarian programs. He's also had involvements with people in and behind the movie The Secret. The walls of his house are covered with spiritual and devotional pictures, his books all center around spirituality, and so does his myspace page. When we talk, I feel like he has a deep wisdom that is not just some show "to get in my pants." He deleted my number because I told him I was feeling pressured and wanted space. He said in that case he would just let me call him so I would have control. You say he is not paying any attention to the friendship part, but we have been hanging out as friends for about 2 1/2 months now and he seems to enjoy just talking, not that he wouldn't be happy if it went further. . . I don't know . . . I was starting to really feel like he is someone I can trust. (I know you're probably thinking that that's his goal, but it's certainly not making me magically want to sleep with him). It's hard for me to believe that he might have been repeatedly lying to my face - that the whole friendship is a lie. I see him as someone with a lot of compassion, openness, and integrity. At the same time maybe I should watch out, because I know he must have a lot of street smarts given his background. However I am inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt: just because a player might use those lines doesn't mean he is one. I really feel like he is a good person. I wish I could test him by saying something like you suggested, lol. Do you have any ideas that are less outrageous? |
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Post by pnoopiepnats on Oct 18, 2008 23:59:39 GMT -5
Do you think all guys will do anything they can to sleep with a girl regardless of her feelings and regardless of honesty, or just "players"? You say he is really working the spiritual angel because he thinks it will work best, but I think I can say beyond a shadow of a doubt that he truly is extremely spiritual. I have searched him on the internet, and have found a couple of detailed biographical articles written about him because of the musical and humanitarian work he does, and they both center around a spiritual transformation he went through. He is a devoted follower of Amma Chi, and is even mentioned on her website for helping start one of her humanitarian programs. He's also had involvements with people in and behind the movie The Secret. The walls of his house are covered with spiritual and devotional pictures, his books all center around spirituality, and so does his myspace page. When we talk, I feel like he has a deep wisdom that is not just some show "to get in my pants." He deleted my number because I told him I was feeling pressured and wanted space. He said in that case he would just let me call him so I would have control. You say he is not paying any attention to the friendship part, but we have been hanging out as friends for about 2 1/2 months now and he seems to enjoy just talking, not that he wouldn't be happy if it went further. . . I don't know . . . I was starting to really feel like he is someone I can trust. (I know you're probably thinking that that's his goal, but it's certainly not making me magically want to sleep with him). It's hard for me to believe that he might have been repeatedly lying to my face - that the whole friendship is a lie. I see him as someone with a lot of compassion, openness, and integrity. At the same time maybe I should watch out, because I know he must have a lot of street smarts given his background. However I am inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt: just because a player might use those lines doesn't mean he is one. I really feel like he is a good person. I wish I could test him by saying something like you suggested, lol. Do you have any ideas that are less outrageous? I'm not saying he isn't truly spiritual. He most likely is! I'm just saying he is working it to impress you and get you in bed. If you don't want to say you are engaged, then just tell him you are dating someone seriously. You need to test him. Honestly, you know he likes you more than a friend. He truly thinks because you keep seeing him and talking to him, that he has a chance with you romantically. So yes, it is leading him on. The kindest thing you can do is end the friendship. |
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Post by Sweet Pea on Oct 19, 2008 0:00:48 GMT -5
because most guys like having sex...alot. it's very important to them. most guys would be absolutely uninterested in a sexless relationship. at least, that's been my experience...and that of lots of other people. not that i blame them. i'm really not either. and yeah, they often will say just about anything to get into your pants, even if they do not 'consciously' plot and plan. But you're suggesting that the whole basis of our friendship is a lie, and if that's the case it seems pretty conscious on his part. It is hard for me to believe he could be so dishonest and despicable. He seems like a genuinely good person. as i said, sometimes people do these things consciously, sometimes unconsciously. do i think most men are scum? not necessarily. do i think most men want to have sex, and have a goal of having sex? um...yeah! i think it would be incredibly naive to think otherwise. do i think that makes them bad, evil people? hell no! but actually, he's told you everthing you need to know to make a decision, and you're still going back. maybe he's right. maybe he can get you into the sack. lol |
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Post by deadendphilosopher on Oct 19, 2008 0:08:58 GMT -5
It's a tough situation but at the end, you'll learn a lot from this. He's got feelings for you and you don't. Maybe you could keep the meetings more sporadic, or even in a public place, such as a library. The reason I say sporadic is because, well, I don't know if you've ever played the Sims game, but the more you hang out with someone, one is bound to like you more and more and once the 'relationship bar' hits over 80 (out of 100) the chance of 'hearts appearing' increase exponentially with every flirtatious move. In the period you're not hanging out with him the number drops and he might meet someone else.. then try to hang out with him and sit on his bed. ;D But, seriously, it's very tough to say anything about the intetions of the guy, so I might be unfair in my recommendation. The whole thing about this being spiritual growth and all, well that all could be, in the sense of learning to love a person other than yourself, but I don't recall Buddha recommending relationships for spiritual growth. Not to mention Krishna, who advocated no sex. In my view of it, it's not necessary for spiritual growth, but, you know, some people learn a lot from relationships. It was very interesting to read that you prayed something like this to happen and it did. It's tough to say if it's causal or not, but your story reminded me of someone else's story. Thanks for the analogy. ;D I will keep it in mind. I don't know if it's necessarily about spiritual growth, but it feels like maybe it is a connection on an energetic level. I don't know, I guess it's probably best not to analyze it. I really liked that Oprah link. When I first watched the Secret it made sense on an intellectual level and I wanted to believe in the law of attraction, but like always my doubts kicked in, and I began to believe it was baloney and wishful thinking. But I will tell you, ever since the beginning of this summer, I have had so many experiences of this type of thing it's not funny! I don't know what I believe, but I have come to feel like the universe is always responding to my thoughts and desires. The thing I really liked about the Oprah interview is that her desire was fulfilled when she believed it wasn't going to happen, when she let go. It is amazing how powerful genuinely letting go is! It's like all of a sudden you've removed some kind of resistance, and then the thing you've been desiring just snaps right to you! I find it very difficult if not impossible to consciously try to let go though. It seems like it's something that just happens. |
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Post by deadendphilosopher on Oct 19, 2008 0:11:44 GMT -5
Do you think all guys will do anything they can to sleep with a girl regardless of her feelings and regardless of honesty, or just "players"? You say he is really working the spiritual angel because he thinks it will work best, but I think I can say beyond a shadow of a doubt that he truly is extremely spiritual. I have searched him on the internet, and have found a couple of detailed biographical articles written about him because of the musical and humanitarian work he does, and they both center around a spiritual transformation he went through. He is a devoted follower of Amma Chi, and is even mentioned on her website for helping start one of her humanitarian programs. He's also had involvements with people in and behind the movie The Secret. The walls of his house are covered with spiritual and devotional pictures, his books all center around spirituality, and so does his myspace page. When we talk, I feel like he has a deep wisdom that is not just some show "to get in my pants." He deleted my number because I told him I was feeling pressured and wanted space. He said in that case he would just let me call him so I would have control. You say he is not paying any attention to the friendship part, but we have been hanging out as friends for about 2 1/2 months now and he seems to enjoy just talking, not that he wouldn't be happy if it went further. . . I don't know . . . I was starting to really feel like he is someone I can trust. (I know you're probably thinking that that's his goal, but it's certainly not making me magically want to sleep with him). It's hard for me to believe that he might have been repeatedly lying to my face - that the whole friendship is a lie. I see him as someone with a lot of compassion, openness, and integrity. At the same time maybe I should watch out, because I know he must have a lot of street smarts given his background. However I am inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt: just because a player might use those lines doesn't mean he is one. I really feel like he is a good person. I wish I could test him by saying something like you suggested, lol. Do you have any ideas that are less outrageous? I'm not saying he isn't truly spiritual. He most likely is! I'm just saying he is working it to impress you and get you in bed. If you don't want to say you are engaged, then just tell him you are dating someone seriously. You need to test him. Honestly, you know he likes you more than a friend. He truly thinks because you keep seeing him and talking to him, that he has a chance with you romantically. So yes, it is leading him on. The kindest thing you can do is end the friendship. I think you are right about ending the friendship.  |
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Post by deadendphilosopher on Oct 19, 2008 0:15:12 GMT -5
But you're suggesting that the whole basis of our friendship is a lie, and if that's the case it seems pretty conscious on his part. It is hard for me to believe he could be so dishonest and despicable. He seems like a genuinely good person. as i said, sometimes people do these things consciously, sometimes unconsciously. do i think most men are scum? not necessarily. do i think most men want to have sex, and have a goal of having sex? um...yeah! i think it would be incredibly naive to think otherwise. do i think that makes them bad, evil people? hell no! but actually, he's told you everthing you need to know to make a decision, and you're still going back. maybe he's right. maybe he can get you into the sack. lol Hey, I never said I was going back! I'm just trying to understand where you think he's coming from because distresses me to think he may have been really dishonest. |
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Post by deadendphilosopher on Oct 19, 2008 0:17:38 GMT -5
I guess my question to Sweet Pea and Jessica Wabbit is, do you think he has been intentionally trying to mislead me and/or use me? I don't think he has, but I'm curious what your opinions are.
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Post by pnoopiepnats on Oct 19, 2008 0:23:41 GMT -5
I guess my question to Sweet Pea and Jessica Wabbit is, do you think he has been intentionally trying to mislead me and/or use me? I don't think he has, but I'm curious what your opinions are. Maybe not consciously. I do think that because of your age and inexperience, he might be taking advantage of that. I have some questions. How old is he exactly? Has he ever been to your house and met your parents? What do you do when you are together? Are you always alone with him together or do you do fun activities that "friends" would normally do. Movies, mini golf, shopping, etc.? What do your parents think of him? |
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Post by Sweet Pea on Oct 19, 2008 0:33:20 GMT -5
I guess my question to Sweet Pea and Jessica Wabbit is, do you think he has been intentionally trying to mislead me and/or use me? I don't think he has, but I'm curious what your opinions are. i'm not there so i won't speculate. i don't think it really matters anyway if you don't want a sexual relationship with him, because he does want that and therefore you'll undoubtedly have to end the relationship regardless of what his motives have been. i'm really more interested in your motives and behavior, because it seems to me you're really acting like someone who isn't quite sure what she wants. i honestly can't believe you'd go to his place and hang out on his bed unless you had mixed feelings. |
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Post by deadendphilosopher on Oct 19, 2008 0:39:46 GMT -5
Hmm, taking advantage of it how? He has told me before that he works really hard to be sensitive to me because of my inexperience (and I think my shyness). He seems to think I am more innocent than I am or something - I brought that up to him when we were talking about our relationship, and he said "Oh good, I hope you will show me your other sides, because I feel like I have to be really careful to walk around eggshells when I'm with you." I don't really know what he meant.
I've never asked him how old he is because I've been afraid it might sound like I'm interested if I ask that, but my guess is around thirty. Yes he has been to my house but we never hang out there. He's met my mom and step dad. Once (after they'd already met) he walked me home at night and saw my mom in the window and shouted out to her, and she and my step dad came out and they all talked for like a half an hour. They both like him a lot, especially my mom. I've discussed the situation with them before and they've encouraged me to be friends with him. We're pretty much always alone, though the first time we hung out was in a coffee shop. There's not a whole lot to do in my town.
What do you think?
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Post by deadendphilosopher on Oct 19, 2008 0:48:43 GMT -5
I guess my question to Sweet Pea and Jessica Wabbit is, do you think he has been intentionally trying to mislead me and/or use me? I don't think he has, but I'm curious what your opinions are. i'm not there so i won't speculate. i don't think it really matters anyway if you don't want a sexual relationship with him, because he does want that and therefore you'll undoubtedly have to end the relationship regardless of what his motives have been. i'm really more interested in your motives and behavior, because it seems to me you're really acting like someone who isn't quite sure what she wants. i honestly can't believe you'd go to his place and hang out on his bed unless you had mixed feelings. I didn't realize the bed thing was such a big deal. I've recently been at college in the dorms where everyone sits on everyone's bed. I'd already told him I just wanted to be friends and I figured that was clear enough from my side, but I'm realizing that was insensitive. I would like a close relationship with him, but it would have to be platonic, which I'm learning isn't possible. I've never had male friends before, so maybe I haven't been that tuned in to the issues that might arise. And I have to admit, his attention is flattering when it's not overwhelming. |
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Post by Sweet Pea on Oct 19, 2008 1:29:00 GMT -5
i'm not there so i won't speculate. i don't think it really matters anyway if you don't want a sexual relationship with him, because he does want that and therefore you'll undoubtedly have to end the relationship regardless of what his motives have been. i'm really more interested in your motives and behavior, because it seems to me you're really acting like someone who isn't quite sure what she wants. i honestly can't believe you'd go to his place and hang out on his bed unless you had mixed feelings. I didn't realize the bed thing was such a big deal. I've recently been at college in the dorms where everyone sits on everyone's bed. I'd already told him I just wanted to be friends and I figured that was clear enough from my side, but I'm realizing that was insensitive. I would like a close relationship with him, but it would have to be platonic, which I'm learning isn't possible. I've never had male friends before, so maybe I haven't been that tuned in to the issues that might arise. And I have to admit, his attention is flattering when it's not overwhelming. i think it's safe to say that for most guys having a woman he wants to have sex with on his bed is a pretty big deal. i'm sure the attention is flattering, but when you look at it from his point of view, do you think what you're doing is really right? |
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Post by rukryM on Oct 19, 2008 9:56:51 GMT -5
This is a very difficult situation, but since you feel you only want to be friends with him and he's mentioned that he both expects and think that it's going to evolve into a relationship somewhere in the future, he clearly hasn't fully understood YOUR intentions so far. Yes, he might be involved in humanitarian work and is a very spiritual person, but it seems to me like he repeats himself over and over again about the relationship thing and strongly believes that it will happen sometime but that you haven't understood it yet. All in all, I think he wants to get laid. I've heard one trillion stories from guys I've talked to about tricking girls into having sex with them, and it involves acting as Mr. Nice and innocent guy.
If he says he accepts the fact that you only want to have a friendship with him, then take a break and stop hanging out for quite some time. See how he reacts then. If he still is patient and has that same warm tone as he had previously, then there might be some truth behind it, but all in all, I think ending the friendship or at least stop seeing each other is the best thing to do.
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Post by deadendphilosopher on Oct 19, 2008 12:25:27 GMT -5
I didn't realize the bed thing was such a big deal. I've recently been at college in the dorms where everyone sits on everyone's bed. I'd already told him I just wanted to be friends and I figured that was clear enough from my side, but I'm realizing that was insensitive. I would like a close relationship with him, but it would have to be platonic, which I'm learning isn't possible. I've never had male friends before, so maybe I haven't been that tuned in to the issues that might arise. And I have to admit, his attention is flattering when it's not overwhelming. i think it's safe to say that for most guys having a woman he wants to have sex with on his bed is a pretty big deal. i'm sure the attention is flattering, but when you look at it from his point of view, do you think what you're doing is really right? No, I don't think it is right, it's insensitive which is why I will not be calling him anymore. I was thinking about the situation and realized sometimes I am confused about what my feelings are. I think I've started developing some tentative (non-sexual) affection for him, which makes me wonder, but when it comes down to it, I don't think I would ever want to have a relationship with him. |
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